Starter click of doom, already have relay.

Chromaphase

Chromaphase

True Classic
Hello Everyone,
Thanks to people from this forum whom helped me in the past, Im enjoying my X recently.

However, something that happened every 5-6 starts, now happens regulary.
When it would happen, I just kept turning the key 3-4 times and it would finally engage.

I have bertone from 1985, Euro 1500 Carb.

Sometimes I try to start, it only click one time and then nothing.
Last time I was stuck so I was thinking the flywheel maybe in a unlucky position.
So I would gear in 1st or 2nd, move my ass in the car, then try again. It worked for me this way for a while.
Last time I stay stuck for 15min on a parking lot because this wasnt working too well. For some reasons it restarted after I gear in 2nd and push the car with my foot outside the door open, to move the car back and forth a little while in gear.

Since then, I tried to start the car while its in front my home, (but this time I havent parked in gear) and the starter worked well for the last 2 days (tried every 5 hours or so)

Even tonite, i just wanted to try, so I turnt the key quickly, and after like 0.5s the motor was already running...
Actually I didnt even want to start the car tonite... haha

So I dont know if I have a bad starter, or something else. I think I already havea relay (see this photo, behind passenger seat)
I have search on this forum and on other forums, Usually its the corrosion or low voltage, I dont think its the case. At the same time, like I just tried 10min ago, the starter is working fine.

Battery is fine, I have a spare battery in my frunk, and when I was stuck on the parking lot I switched battery, no effect.

New Starter is pricy and hard to find in France, and the reduction gear ones are even pricier.
Im just not even sure its the starter.

Thanks !
 

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Chromaphase said:
Hello Everyone,
Thanks to people from this forum whom helped me in the past, Im enjoying my X recently.

However, something that happened every 5-6 starts, now happens regulary.
When it would happen, I just kept turning the key 3-4 times and it would finally engage.

I have bertone from 1985, Euro 1500 Carb.

Sometimes I try to start, it only click one time and then nothing.
Last time I was stuck so I was thinking the flywheel maybe in a unlucky position.
So I would gear in 1st or 2nd, move my ass in the car, then try again. It worked for me this way for a while.
Last time I stay stuck for 15min on a parking lot because this wasnt working too well. For some reasons it restarted after I gear in 2nd and push the car with my foot outside the door open, to move the car back and forth a little while in gear.

Since then, I tried to start the car while its in front my home, (but this time I havent parked in gear) and the starter worked well for the last 2 days (tried every 5 hours or so)

Even tonite, i just wanted to try, so I turnt the key quickly, and after like 0.5s the motor was already running...
Actually I didnt even want to start the car tonite... haha

So I dont know if I have a bad starter, or something else. I think I already havea relay (see this photo, behind passenger seat)
I have search on this forum and on other forums, Usually its the corrosion or low voltage, I dont think its the case. At the same time, like I just tried 10min ago, the starter is working fine.

Battery is fine, I have a spare battery in my frunk, and when I was stuck on the parking lot I switched battery, no effect.

New Starter is pricy and hard to find in France, and the reduction gear ones are even pricier.
Im just not even sure its the starter.

Thanks !
Click to expand...
That relay looks stock, and location and wire colors point to it being for the carburetor cooling fan.
 
ng_randolph said:
That relay looks stock, and location and wire colors point to it being for the carburetor cooling fan.
Click to expand...

Humm I see ! But the red wire we see there, isnt the red wire from the solenoid ?
Just checked, they both red... didnt know the carb blower needed a relay.

So its kind of a good news I guess ? Means its a problem with the solenoid not receiving enough juice from the ignition switch?

Actually to fix this problem, Im looking also to put my ignition button behind the passenger seat, on the ground, as a safe lock for my X.

Should I take off the black tape around the wires and look for the ignition switch wire ?
 
My 86 X did this for 30 years before it started happening too often for comfort. I had the OEM Marelli starter & solenoids are hard to find. Had an old Bosch unit rebuilt from a 79 or 81 I parted. Parts were in stock at the rebuilder for this unit.
 
Last edited:
Chromaphase said:
Have you down the relay trick ?
Click to expand...
@visualistics thread is here - it's worth testing insitu with a short jumper wire at the starter unless you go straight for the hard start relay:

Unpredictable Starting

So last time I tried to drive my X (weeks ago) the starter was weak and felt like it was grinding, and eventually it just stopped working altogether and the car wouldn’t start. So I bought a new starter and replaced that last night, easy peasy other than working in the tight confines under the...
xwebforums.com
 
Ics19 said:
@visualistics thread is here - it's worth testing insitu with a short jumper wire at the starter unless you go straight for the hard start relay:

Unpredictable Starting

So last time I tried to drive my X (weeks ago) the starter was weak and felt like it was grinding, and eventually it just stopped working altogether and the car wouldn’t start. So I bought a new starter and replaced that last night, easy peasy other than working in the tight confines under the...
xwebforums.com
Click to expand...
I have read this thread before but I was so confused because when I checked I already had a relay. At the exact same position show on the photo with the relay modification...

But if its the relay for the carb fan, maybe I can use this relay, because I dont have carb fan anymore so its kind of useless hanging there.

I will re-read all of this ! Sometimes Im confused because my car is a EU Bertone from 1985, so there are so difference there and there.
 
JKIDD said:
My 86 X did this for 30 years before it started happening too often for comfort. I had the OEM Marelli starter & solenoids are hard to find. Had an old Bosch unit rebuilt from a 79 or 81 I parted. Parts were in stock at the rebuilder for this unit.
Click to expand...

My 1979 did the exact same thing for the same number of years. I ended up having it replaced with a gear reduction starter a couple years ago. Game changer for sure.
 
Chromaphase said:
I have read this thread before but I was so confused because when I checked I already had a relay. At the exact same position show on the photo with the relay modification...

But if its the relay for the carb fan, maybe I can use this relay, because I dont have carb fan anymore so its kind of useless hanging there.

I will re-read all of this ! Sometimes Im confused because my car is a EU Bertone from 1985, so there are so difference there and there.
Click to expand...
Yes I think that is carb fan relay. You could repurpose it for a starter relay, but first check the current it can take.

Its not a difficult job, just a bit of wiring change and you are away
 
Alex(Tenerife) said:
Yes I think that is carb fan relay. You could repurpose it for a starter relay, but first check the current it can take.

Its not a difficult job, just a bit of wiring change and you are away
Click to expand...
Actually I have a fat brand new relay at hand (used for another car headlight but finally didnt use it)
I will replace it. I will take new photo of the process and post them as well in this other thread so we can see also how it looks for a carb X (small relay for carb fan, and there is not that big relay block as well)

Its pretty well explained so I will do it as soon as I receive the fuses and the 10mm connector to the starter.
On the photo you will understand the confusion. there is 2 red wires 10Ga, but I guess I found which one is what.
I can even repurpose the blue 10Ga wire giving the 12v for the Carb Fan, maybe to add a light fixture in the back of the seat/roof !
 
Multiple things.
When working on anything electrical remove the negative cable from the battery.
Start at the battery. Clean, ream and then tighten the clamps to the battery to get the best possible contact to the positive and negative posts.
Remove the ground strap from the body at the battery. Clean the connection at the body and use either an electrically conductive paste or dielectric grease when reassembling the connection.
Go back to the drivers side under the car and remove the ground strap from the transmission and body connection. Verify the braided cable is in good condition and then cleaned the connection areas. Clean both connections on the body and transmission and reassemble as above.
Remove the cable and wires from the starter. Clean and reinstall with dielectric grease.

Verify function.

If it is still intermittent I would install a starter relay to take the heavy load off the ignition switch. This to me is a good move regardless.

This is how I do it:
Post in thread 'x1/9 headlight Mod. Help!!'
https://xwebforums.com/forum/index.php?threads/x1-9-headlight-mod-help.42693/post-403694 sorry for the poor documentation.
I liked using the existing factory wire to the starter solenoid from the relay so I unwrapped the loom, cut the existing wire near the transition from horizontal to go up the firewall, spliced in a connector with a lighter gauge red wire to the thick red wire to excite the relay. I then crimped a connector onto the heavy red wire to the starter to go to the 87 on the relay. Added a new wire from the main lug of the starter to power the relay, I added an inline fuse after I took the pic in that thread.

If the relay doesn’t cure your problem, I would first verify you have consistent voltage at the excite wire to the relay which is easy to check with a voltmeter.

If there is consistent power to the the 86 pin of the relay then you definitely have a starter problem
 
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