Placing Jackstands

Chad C. said:
getting my car safely on stands is a current need for a better height for paint preparation
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This may be a little outside of the box, and I don't know if it can be applied to your Scorpion. But for the restoration of my import truck I needed to be able to have full access to the entire undercarriage to run new brake lines, fuel lines, wires, exhaust, redo the undercoating, etc., plus do all of the bodywork and repaint the body. I considered making a rotisserie but decided I really did not want to go to that extent. So I made some simple brackets that bolt to the stock bumper mounting points (toward each corner of the vehicle) and attached four-foot sections of 4x4 posts to them. Now the truck is sitting a little over 3 feet off the floor, with all of the suspension removed and a ton of room to work under it, plus great access to the bodywork without bending over. It has been like that for a couple of years (I work slow) and is super stable. Didn't cost much and was easy to do. The next time I have it uncovered I'll try to remember to take a picture for you.
 
NEG said:
Search ebay for ‘jack stand pads’!
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been there done that - still too stupid. Guess I'm looking for someone who's posted a photo of their jack stands contacting an X 1/9 in the right place. A clear photo of actual use. :)
 
kmead said:
From Missouri I take it?

Some pretty explicit pics of the ‘where’ showing the bottom of the car a few pages ago
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Wouldn't set foot there if my car depended on it. Nothing in this thread. Well, it depends on your definition of 'clear photo', or good photo. Maybe I'm not the stupid one afterall. lol
 
JimD said:
Well cool, one more person I don't have to expend any more effort helping.
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Oh c’mon, he cracked a joke, I cracked one back. Guess you‘re not helping either of us then? If I got upset at the number of times I read about ‘Kommie Kalifornia’ I‘d be in an institution 😜
PS - I rooted for the Blues in 2019...
 
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I think you missed the Show Me part of the joke :)

OK a more serious answer.

There is no one place you need to put the jackstands under. It depends on what you are intending to work on or it can be advantageous to put them in a different place. Having more room to do a particular job is valuable and choosing the proper safe place to place them is critical.

On a short, mid engine car with little overhang it can be difficult to get a jack stand in the right place to ensure safe placement at the rear in particular.

On the first page of this thread is an image of the entire bottom of an X which has not changed much in the years the car was made. There are a number of places to lift the car and place jack stands. I will mark up the original and post it as a guideline but you will have to use your judgement as to which spots to use for the job you are doing.
 
tvmaster said:
been there done that - still too stupid. Guess I'm looking for someone who's posted a photo of their jack stands contacting an X 1/9 in the right place. A clear photo of actual use. :)
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Get one set of these pads (or similar) and place them on the pinch weld at the front of the car as shown in this earlier post on this thread.

For the rear, you could use another set of those same pinch weld pads for jack stands or you can get a Porsche style pad and cut another grove for the pinch weld or just trim that off. Something like this. The idea is to support the car on that structure at the rear. The "pilot hole" keeps the pad there.

These areas were used at Bertone factory to cart cars around. There's a photo of it on the cover of Henk's "la storia" book he published where you see the X1/9 shells on a dolly using these points.
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Interestingly, the "pilot holes" or "indexing holes" on front and rear are different. ~7/8" diameter for front, ~1 1/8" diameter rear. It's probably metric ? (22mm/28mm).
 
darwoodious said:
Get one set of these pads (or similar) and place them on the pinch weld at the front of the car as shown in this earlier post on this thread.

For the rear, you could use another set of those same pinch weld pads for jack stands or you can get a Porsche style pad and cut another grove for the pinch weld or just trim that off. Something like this. The idea is to support the car on that structure at the rear. The "pilot hole" keeps the pad there.

These areas were used at Bertone factory to cart cars around. There's a photo of it on the cover of Henk's "la storia" book he published where you see the X1/9 shells on a dolly using these points.
View attachment 47783
View attachment 47782
View attachment 47784

Interestingly, the "pilot holes" or "indexing holes" on front and rear are different. ~7/8" diameter for front, ~1 1/8" diameter rear. It's probably metric ? (22mm/28mm).
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Brilliant - thanks for the visual aids. Not all of us using the internet are mechanics, but it gets easier with quality coaching :) I saw that photo of the FIAT factory, but it was unclear what exactly was going on. These snaps make it crystal clear. Like I said to you in another thread - small steps. One at a time...
 
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Jefco said:
C'mon Jim, he's funny. 12 point sockets are for 12-point hardware, right? LMAO
He really needs the help.
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You know what’s great about the internet? You can learn stuff there, about things, people, etc. And it’s amazing how much information is available for people with questions who didn’t know these things before. It’s especially great that people take the time to post rather detailed information to questions that some people seem to assume EVERYONE should know the answers to. Those are really great people.
Everyday I learn something new, I’ve had a good day.

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The four green circles are where you can lift the car. The ones on the sides you can lift the entire side of the car. The one at the front lifts the front and the one at the rear (it is actually a black rectangle which is part of the engine crossmember) lifts both rear wheels.

The four with holes at the corners of the wheel openings (behind the front wheels and in front of the rear wheels) are the places you would put a jack stand with a pin or a resilient block.

Personally I never use the pinch weld directly for a few reasons, it is delicate, it tends to be some of the most eaten by rust and they are often damaged on an older car from idiots from the past who have crushed them. The pinch weld rubber blocks likely are fine, I just have seen too many cars with crushed rockers…

The suspension mounting points can be used if the suspension arm is installed so the whole thing is fully supported. I avoid the mount for the radius arm as it is delicate and can be bent (it is the bolted to the two flat areas to the left of the front lift point with the three holes, no bracket is shown there).

I prefer rubber blocks which are softer as they conform to the car, the jack and the jack stand. Then tend not to slide and distribute the load over a larger area.
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tvmaster said:
Everyday I learn something new, I’ve had a good day
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I also learn from your questions, don't get me wrong, I think it's great that you were not only interested enough to buy an X, but also are embracing the DIY aspect!
I started as a jet mechanic 45 years ago, and have never heard the 6-point vs 12-point question before; it struck me as particularly funny, no offense intended. ;)
 
There seems to be a difference of opinion about the forward support points. If you used the point around the drain hole (fuzzy circle below) you would have to cut a hole on a support block to clear the drain tube to prevent crushing it, also the inner sill is further inboard at this point so not as strong. The hole at the red circle IMHO would be better but it is still only single panel thickness, but close to the pinch weld and the inner sill. I generally use the flat area just behind the lower control arm pivot in the yellow square, it has multilayers of thickness, and it is strong enough for the suspension to bolt to. I can't get to this point on my track car, so I use a block on the pinch weld between the red circle and fuzzy circle where there is a welded joint in the outer sill.
stand.jpg
 
Yes...

Just lifting to change a tire? Use the built in jack point here circled in green.
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Do NOT use the "drain hole" on the lower left in this photo. Not structural I think.

Suspension mounting points are always good usually. I think it depends on the work being done thought - i.e., if you're working on the suspension this obviously is out of the question.

Regarding lifting on the "pinch welds" - I believe the lift pads referenced do not actually lift on the pinch welded metal itself, rather on the material very near to it, thus giving the best strength possible. On an X1/9, that pinch weld is part of the very LONG longitudinal beam running from the front to rear and is very strong.

End of the day it all depends... I've used the central front and rear areas @kmead points out without issues. Changing a tire I've used the stock jack as well as a jack on the stock jack point without issue (lifts one side of the vehicle). I assumed this thread was about using jack stands to lift the entire vehicle and that is what my reply addresses.
 
darwoodious said:
Yes...

Just lifting to change a tire? Use the built in jack point here circled in green.
View attachment 47800

Do NOT use the "drain hole" on the lower left in this photo. Not structural I think.

Suspension mounting points are always good usually. I think it depends on the work being done thought - i.e., if you're working on the suspension this obviously is out of the question.

Regarding lifting on the "pinch welds" - I believe the lift pads referenced do not actually lift on the pinch welded metal itself, rather on the material very near to it, thus giving the best strength possible. On an X1/9, that pinch weld is part of the very LONG longitudinal beam running from the front to rear and is very strong.

End of the day it all depends... I've used the central front and rear areas @kmead points out without issues. Changing a tire I've used the stock jack as well as a jack on the stock jack point without issue (lifts one side of the vehicle). I assumed this thread was about using jack stands to lift the entire vehicle and that is what my reply addresses.
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Yes - my paranoia comes from an experience with the 500 Abarth's side sills, which, when the car is improperly lifted, separate from their glue and anchors, causing thousands in repair costs. My local Chrysler dealer had to pay the freight on three cars (about $2500 per) an employee lifted like it was a RAM pickup, mine being one of them. So now I am uber-careful about something I've never cared about for 30 years.
Thanks for all these great pics and references everyone - this will be a super thread for new owners for sure...
 
Every time I see this thread I get reminded of the time I put jackstands on the left and right side jack point right behind the driver seat simultaneously (green central circle in a photo above). Lost my mind when I went to open the frunk and the front wheels lifted off the ground. Like a 2000lb seesaw.

Mid engine joys.
 
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